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 Analyzing the why behind the backlash of Fallen Kingdom and how valid it is

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PostSubject: Re: Analyzing the why behind the backlash of Fallen Kingdom and how valid it is   Sun Jul 01, 2018 5:25 pm

Thank you! I got confused for a bit and thinking they were the same guy ahah thanks for the clarification

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PostSubject: Re: Analyzing the why behind the backlash of Fallen Kingdom and how valid it is   Sun Jul 01, 2018 7:10 pm

If you read user reviews for the movie on imdb, the top voted one is this one I will copy and paste here. This guy really nails it, and it's quite a funny read, too:

Ten things about Fallen Kingdom
petra_ste14 June 2018
Warning: Spoilers
1) It's bad. I didn't like Jurassic World, but this is worse. It's got broad characters, lackluster set-pieces, a noisy score and the kind of script which should be punishable by throwing its writers to sharks. At least Jurassic World, mediocre as it was, had the good sense to copy the first Jurassic Park. Fallen Kingdom foolishly imitates The Lost World instead, with a semi-watchable first half on the island and an abysmal last act with dinosaurs wreaking havoc back to civilization.

Kudos to the late John Hammond for building his park on a volcanic island. Also, I hate to ask but, since it's a plot point that dinosaurs will face extinction (again!) if they are not rescued from Isla Nublar's volcano... what happened to Isla Sorna (Jurassic Park 2 and 3)? There were dinosaurs on it as well. I'm sure some novelization or website makes up a lame excuse, but the movie doesn't.

2) Stop overcomplicating blockbusters. Jurassic Park featured an intelligent, complex sci-fi premise, but the actual plot had an elegant simplicity to it. Fallen Kingdom tosses in betrayals, cloned little girls and evil corporations selling dinosaurs to warlords.

3) Speaking of that, enough with the "dinosaurs as military weapons" nonsense! This is a concept which appealed to all of us when we were kids ("I want to ride a T-Rex! And it should have a rocket launcher on it!")... but you cannot have War Dinosaurs in anything that wants to be taken seriously by adults.

You know why Navy SEALs don't have units of trained lions? Why no army has rhinos bred to be ridden into battle? Because nobody in modern warfare would spend money (let alone MILLIONS as in this movie) for a huge beast which would be an economical and logistical nightmare to raise, train, feed and manage, especially when a random enemy soldier could blow it to smithereens with a 100 $ grenade. Someone should tell writer Colin Trevorrow that war elephants aren't a thing anymore, while firearms and explosives are.

(Note that the dinosaur boogeyman of this movie, the Indoraptor, is so ineffectual that it repeatedly fails to kill its unarmed targets in the endless climax. Some infallible weapon: there is a scene where three characters are pinned under a tree and the Indoraptor manages to... scratch one of them in the knee before they escape. You know what could have killed them more efficiently than your 30-million-dollars War Dinosaur? One guy with a pistol!)

4) Fallen Kingdom assumes you are really, really interested in Blue, the Chris Pratt-trained Raptor from Jurassic World. The script retcons Blue into a sympathetic, heroic creature which displayed diligence and empathy since it was young; funny, I recall it killing several innocents in the previous movie (and attacking Pratt himself with no provocation in their first scene), but whatever.

5) Since we mentioned Chris Pratt: much like Jurassic World, this movie doesn't know how to use him. Pratt is ideally cast not as a badass, but as someone who *thinks* is a badass - a character who is capable but somewhat out of his league. He works so much better as a slightly comedic, self-deprecating protagonist (Guardians of the Galaxy) than as a tediously infallible, dead-eyed action figure.

His Owen never changes. There is more character development implied with a small prop in Jurassic Park (the Raptor claw Grant uses to scare a kid at the beginning, which he throws away after bonding with Lex and Tim) than in all Owen's scenes in Fallen Kingdom.

6) Howard is inoffensive but unremarkable as Claire: she is just kind of there, blandly good-looking, doing no damage but adding little value, like some sort of redhead lettuce. Her two sidekicks (Scared Nerd and Tough Latina) are insufferable though.

(By the way, how is Claire not rotting in jail as the aftermath of Jurassic World? She is directly responsible for the dozens of casualties there, poorly handling the Indominus' escape and refusing to evacuate the island. She must have one hell of a lawyer.)

7) Poor Rafe Spall, a competent actor (see The Ritual, a much better monster movie), plays Greedy Corporate Guy, an antagonist so flat and obvious that I was disappointed he didn't get an Evil Laugh Scene... you know, he throws his head back and bellows "Bwahaha!" while the camera cranes up.

I love how Rafe Spall builds a containment facility for dinosaurs under James Cromwell's mansion. Cromwell plays Old Sick Naive Rich Guy. Sorry, I don't care how old, sick and naive you are: you have no excuses if you don't realize someone is HIDING DINOSAURS IN YOUR BASEMENT. Really, Trevorrow? Is this some kind of spoof?

8 ) CGI is fine but overused. It's a visually busy movie.

I'll give them credit for making the Indoraptor more visually distinctive than the boring-looking Indominus. At least they sort of splashed some yellow on it.

9) I didn't care for most of the set-pieces. Remember how Spielberg took his sweet time with the T-Rex breakout or the Raptors in the kichen? Here most action beats are over right after they begin (the Baryonyx, the Carnotaurus...). There is no build-up, no crescendo. It's the cinematic equivalent of premature ejaculation.

I did mildly enjoy the prologue with the T-Rex and the Mosasaurus, although... why would the park build a giant door which allows the Mosasaurus to swim away into the ocean? What kind of scenario were they envisioning in which the escape of the humongous sea monster would be a positive outcome?

I mean, come on. I'm not usually a nitpicker, but this movie seems to be actively trolling anyone giving it a minimum amount of thought.

10) The stupid ending sets up another sequel. I guess we'll finally get the inevitable War Dinosaurs.

*sigh*

4,5/10

To people asking "What were you expecting in a film about dinosaurs?", I answer: "Something maybe not on par, but at least in the same league as Jurassic Park, one of my favorite movies of all time".

Still, if all you want is an action/adventure with many different dinos, regardless of lousy storytelling and flat characters, have fun with this one.
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PostSubject: Re: Analyzing the why behind the backlash of Fallen Kingdom and how valid it is   Sun Jul 01, 2018 8:07 pm

2) Stop overcomplicating blockbusters. Jurassic Park featured an intelligent, complex sci-fi premise, but the actual plot had an elegant simplicity to it. Fallen Kingdom tosses in betrayals, cloned little girls and evil corporations selling dinosaurs to warlords.



yeah lets just do the same thing over and over!
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PostSubject: Re: Analyzing the why behind the backlash of Fallen Kingdom and how valid it is   Sun Jul 01, 2018 8:18 pm

With so many complaints that FK is really stupid, this guy/gal thinks it's overly complicated? They just can't win. Laughing

However, I do agree that "The Ritual" was a decent monster movie - it's available on Netflix.
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PostSubject: Re: Analyzing the why behind the backlash of Fallen Kingdom and how valid it is   Sun Jul 01, 2018 8:44 pm

Honestly I’m less tired of the comments about the film being stupid, and more the ones that I’m a stupid person for liking it. And some critics and reviewers are doing that. I can like what I like and still be an generally intelligent person.

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PostSubject: Re: Analyzing the why behind the backlash of Fallen Kingdom and how valid it is   Mon Jul 02, 2018 1:10 am

^This. 100% this Very Happy
You can hate a movie with a burning passion, and criticizing the movie's flaws is completely fine (and this movie did have them), but to insult other people and tell them that they are less intelligent for liking it is absurd and unprofessional beyond belief. This is one s****y movie reviews trend that I wish would cease to exist. But unfortunately, some people don't understand that- just look at twitter and youtube.
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PostSubject: Re: Analyzing the why behind the backlash of Fallen Kingdom and how valid it is   Mon Jul 02, 2018 1:23 am

I agree that its really uncalled for, its not a test to be graded that has actual answers. Its just taste and opinion. I hope no one has taken any of my comments that way. The only reason I express them is not to change anyone's opinion really, rather so that they can say "its a great movie, but I'd like to see such and such improved." Just in case someone from the production of these films ever happens to read our comments.

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PostSubject: Re: Analyzing the why behind the backlash of Fallen Kingdom and how valid it is   Mon Jul 02, 2018 1:27 am

^Oh absoulutely, there's nothing wrong with that- your criticism is well written and completely justified on every account Very Happy In fact, I will say that atleast here even the most negative criticism brings up actual, good points about the movie's missteps and how they could have been improved and never once it degrades into insulting others. I was more refering to the youtube critic base, and oh boy I have seen some s*it..


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PostSubject: Re: Analyzing the why behind the backlash of Fallen Kingdom and how valid it is   Mon Jul 02, 2018 1:35 am

@Lost wrote:
3) Speaking of that, enough with the "dinosaurs as military weapons" nonsense! This is a concept which appealed to all of us when we were kids ("I want to ride a T-Rex! And it should have a rocket launcher on it!")... but you cannot have War Dinosaurs in anything that wants to be taken seriously by adults.

You know why Navy SEALs don't have units of trained lions? Why no army has rhinos bred to be ridden into battle? Because nobody in modern warfare would spend money (let alone MILLIONS as in this movie) for a huge beast which would be an economical and logistical nightmare to raise, train, feed and manage, especially when a random enemy soldier could blow it to smithereens with a 100 $ grenade. Someone should tell writer Colin Trevorrow that war elephants aren't a thing anymore, while firearms and explosives are.

To be fair, the "dinosaurs as weapons" subplot is Spielberg's fault, not Trevorrow's. Spielberg for some reason loves the idea and keeps pushing the writers to include that in some way in these new movies. Trevorrow has admitted in an interview he agrees that the idea of weaponized dinosaurs is kind of silly and unrealistic, but he has to include it anyway, because it's Steven Spielberg.

You might recall that a lot of the ideas/scripts for the fourth movie (back when it was stuck in development hell) included weaponized dinosaurs in some capacity, waaay before Trevorrow got involved with the franchise. Spielberg always thought that having dinosaurs in wars would be the next logical step for the franchise.

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PostSubject: Re: Analyzing the why behind the backlash of Fallen Kingdom and how valid it is   Mon Jul 02, 2018 2:37 am

@Mr. Robustus wrote:
@Lost wrote:
3) Speaking of that, enough with the "dinosaurs as military weapons" nonsense! This is a concept which appealed to all of us when we were kids ("I want to ride a T-Rex! And it should have a rocket launcher on it!")... but you cannot have War Dinosaurs in anything that wants to be taken seriously by adults.

You know why Navy SEALs don't have units of trained lions? Why no army has rhinos bred to be ridden into battle? Because nobody in modern warfare would spend money (let alone MILLIONS as in this movie) for a huge beast which would be an economical and logistical nightmare to raise, train, feed and manage, especially when a random enemy soldier could blow it to smithereens with a 100 $ grenade. Someone should tell writer Colin Trevorrow that war elephants aren't a thing anymore, while firearms and explosives are.

To be fair, the "dinosaurs as weapons" subplot is Spielberg's fault, not Trevorrow's. Spielberg for some reason loves the idea and keeps pushing the writers to include that in some way in these new movies. Trevorrow has admitted in an interview he agrees that the idea of weaponized dinosaurs is kind of silly and unrealistic, but he has to include it anyway, because it's Steven Spielberg.

You might recall that a lot of the ideas/scripts for the fourth movie (back when it was stuck in development hell) included weaponized dinosaurs in some capacity, waaay before Trevorrow got involved with the franchise. Spielberg always thought that having dinosaurs in wars would be the next logical step for the franchise.

Yes, I seem to recall to have read this somewhere, and again, I didn't write this, I merely copied and pasted the top rated review on imdb, as it addressed many of the complaints that people have about this movie.
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PostSubject: Re: Analyzing the why behind the backlash of Fallen Kingdom and how valid it is   Mon Jul 02, 2018 3:19 am

Yea just saw a tweet where some guy basically called everyone stupid for giving this film money. I also think it is unfair when some critics say things like "if you didn't see the original or were not a fan of it then you will like this movie".
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PostSubject: Re: Analyzing the why behind the backlash of Fallen Kingdom and how valid it is   Mon Jul 02, 2018 9:45 am

@Bionic wrote:
Quote :

Admittedly, my initial post does not belong in a normal discussion as well, however, it was more of first reaction towards your line about militarization of dino's ''complete rubbish like any normal person would tell you''.

Nevertheless, no reason to continue that.

I was always quite neutral about the concept of militarization of dino's. It is not far-etched when you think about it. Not sure how you see it as forced but I do think that they did explained it quite simplistic in JW. I mean in my favourite scenario every Jurassic movie would be like 30 min longer all dedicated towards character & story development. Something all the movies lack in my opinion. Perhaps the simplistic story telling made it feel forced to you?

I cannot remember the fight sequence in detail of the Indo versus Blue. I know the Indominius was quite consistent in that regard but I can't respond about the JWFK fight.

About the cloning, yeah probably. I can see it being very profitable. Perfect human cloning could even have an bigger impact on the world than dinosaurs

How can you say it is not far fetched, it sounds like you have no idea what you are talking about or that you don't know what JP is about. In JW it was only a sideplot but frankly it was the one element where eyeryone sreamed 'Bad idea'.
Making it the mainplot is turning people off, so no surprise this entry is getting trashed by the reviews.
Anyone who has worked in the military will tell you that it would be complete nonsense to use animals in combat.
You'd have to bring in more supplies, they would need to be completely quiet when the enemy is close by, and considering that militarized dinos would be very costly to produce it wouldn't be worth it when they get a single shot and die.
You are seriously wondering why it feels forced? It's one of the reasons this hardly felt like a Jurassic film. It's grossly outlandish and just really stupid.

What JP is about is pretty different for anybody. For me the Islands are an important element to the franchise while many others are hoping that the movie goes towards the mainland. Enhancing dinosaurs through genetic modification fits enough within the overall JP theme in my opinion though.

Like I said, it is not like you could use them in any situation. Heck using the I-rex as portrayed in JW would have been nonsenses, as it is uncontrollable. But if you take the I-rex that was undetectable by heat sensors, perfected senses, camouflage and highly resistant towards bullets, you will miss only one important element, that they can be controlled like a dog. If they succeed in adding that component, such dinosaur would be a very lethal addition for in certain combat situations.

By the way, no I would never want to see that in a Jurassic movie as that is not what a Jurassic movie is mainly about. This side-plot was fun, for me at least, but I see no reason in continuing that.
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PostSubject: Re: Analyzing the why behind the backlash of Fallen Kingdom and how valid it is   Mon Jul 02, 2018 10:46 am

@Lost wrote:
Yes, I seem to recall to have read this somewhere, and again, I didn't write this, I merely copied and pasted the top rated review on imdb, as it addressed many of the complaints that people have about this movie.

Oh, my bad. Didn't catch that first part.

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PostSubject: Re: Analyzing the why behind the backlash of Fallen Kingdom and how valid it is   Tue Jul 03, 2018 11:12 am

As we can see the casual fans/general public have pointed out some legitimate things about this movie. All of this has shown that it is not one of those movies where people just hate on it to be "cool" and that the general public/casual fans are indeed very aware of the details of this franchise so there goes the myth that the "General audience does not pay attention to plot holes".

This is why (and I apologize if I sound like I am trying to push an agenda) I insist that imput from a hardcore fan was needed for both Jurassic World and Jurassic World Fallen Kingdom.

Now usually when I say that some fans argue that imput from hardcore fans could ruin the movies written by writers who even though they are professionals, are not really that much of a fan of the franchise....But look at how we are doing so far? Neither JW nor JWFK are praised or respected movies. They made a lot of money? Sure, but that is more due to the fame of the brand name. The fact is that even though some thought JW was a kinda fun popcorn movie, a lot of people dislike many things it did and many have pointed out that it has some things in it that make no sense. And now JWFK has taken that to another level just waaay too many things that make no sense to the point of it getting called "Worse than JP3" and "The Last Jedi of the Jurassic franchise" on a daily basis.

So would imput from hardcore fans really hurt that much? It is not like they could ruin some thing that is considered a masterpiece.


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PostSubject: Re: Analyzing the why behind the backlash of Fallen Kingdom and how valid it is   Tue Jul 03, 2018 12:14 pm

I'm pretty sure the Sorna mention was done for the hardcore fans.

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PostSubject: Re: Analyzing the why behind the backlash of Fallen Kingdom and how valid it is   Wed Jul 04, 2018 4:48 am

#TRexSpinorematch wrote:
As we can see the casual fans/general public have pointed out some legitimate things about this movie. All of this has shown that it is not one of those movies where people just hate on it to be "cool" and that the general public/casual fans are indeed very aware of the details of this franchise so there goes the myth that the "General audience does not pay attention to plot holes".

This is why (and I apologize if I sound like I am trying to push an agenda) I insist that imput from a hardcore fan was needed for both Jurassic World and Jurassic World Fallen Kingdom.

Now usually when I say that some fans argue that imput from hardcore fans could ruin the movies written by writers who even though they are professionals, are not really that much of a fan of the franchise....But look at how we are doing so far? Neither JW nor JWFK are praised or respected movies. They made a lot of money? Sure, but that is more due to the fame of the brand name. The fact is that even though some thought JW was a kinda fun popcorn movie, a lot of people dislike many things it did and many have pointed out that it has some things in it that make no sense. And now JWFK has taken that to another level just waaay too many things that make no sense to the point of it getting called "Worse than JP3" and "The Last Jedi of the Jurassic franchise" on a daily basis.

So would imput from hardcore fans really hurt that much? It is not like they could ruin some thing that is considered a masterpiece.


Again, the people I know in real life all loved the movie (some even think it's the best sequel to JP, and I agree btw). Majority of people in this forum, if you look at the poll, liked the movie.
In a recent Twitter poll with many voters, FK was considered the 2nd best sequel right after TLW.
Fact is, the negativity is louder: when someone didn't like the movie, he/she makes a dramatic post about how FK is the worst film ever made and that there's no logic from start to finish.

To me it's a bit like Jurassic World or The Lost World: majority enjoyed it, some loved it, some hated it profoundly.

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PostSubject: Re: Analyzing the why behind the backlash of Fallen Kingdom and how valid it is   Wed Jul 04, 2018 9:07 am

There are people who do like the movie (and they have every right to). But this forum only has like 12 or 15 active members who post on a daily basis, same with Jurassic Outpost, and the same could be said about people you know in real life, between friends and family the average person might have around 20 people in their inner circle, that is not enough to give you a consensus of of how a fanbase of millions feels. Even Jurassic Park 3 has fans. They are a minority but there are people out there who do love JP3. However the reality is that the vast majority of people consider it one of the most unpopular films in the franchise even back in 2001 the backlash was felt very strongly before social media. So it wasn't like it was just a minority being loud.

Same thing with Fallen Kingdom, yeah, there are fans who do really like it but if you search thousands of videos on Youtube about the film you will notice that the majority see the film on a negative light, same thing on the comments section of those videos, I have to sometimes dig deep to find positive comments. Also notice that even those who do like it have recognized that it has things in it that are very questionable. So that's my point, this is not one of those films where fans are just hating on it more just because it did not give them what they want, or just hating on it just to hate on it, it is one of those films that has various very questionable things in it and that's why it is getting hate, and I am not even sure hate is the word, it is more like a big let down on many areas that seems to be the reaction from most people.
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PostSubject: Re: Analyzing the why behind the backlash of Fallen Kingdom and how valid it is   Wed Jul 04, 2018 9:35 am

There's no way FK is generally considered worse or at the level of JP3 in terms of backlash. That Twitter poll I mentioned had, I think, something like 500 voters and FK had much more votes than JP3 by far.
When that same poll asked instead the least favorite film, JP3 won by far, then it came JW and then FK.

I said people I know in my life because they have various tastes (some are JP fans, some just casual viewers) and I saw very positive reactions. The people in the theater seemed pretty happy as well, both three times I saw the movie.

There's a lot of hate towards JW as well, but also lot of love.

Does it have questionable things? Sure, but seems like some forget the great things about FK that JP3 doesn't have.


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PostSubject: Re: Analyzing the why behind the backlash of Fallen Kingdom and how valid it is   Wed Jul 04, 2018 11:36 am

con·fir·ma·tion bi·as
noun
the tendency to interpret new evidence as confirmation of one's existing beliefs or theories.

This applies to both sides of the argument here. The only real consensus we have are:

Our Polls
Rating Scores

Numbers dont lie. Thus JWFK rates above JP3 and barely below TLW. On IMDB JWFK is like 0.1 better but on rotten tomatoes and metacritic it's only 51% on both while TLW is 53% and 59% respectively
According to Google users voting 88% like TLW and 91% like JWFK.

In the end it falls right in line with TLW I feel.

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PostSubject: Re: Analyzing the why behind the backlash of Fallen Kingdom and how valid it is   Wed Jul 04, 2018 12:43 pm

@Spiegel wrote:
con·fir·ma·tion bi·as
noun
the tendency to interpret new evidence as confirmation of one's existing beliefs or theories.

This applies to both sides of the argument here. The only real consensus we have are:

Our Polls
Rating Scores

Numbers dont lie. Thus JWFK rates above JP3 and barely below TLW. On IMDB JWFK is like 0.1 better but on rotten tomatoes and metacritic it's only 51% on both while TLW is 53% and 59% respectively
According to Google users voting 88% like TLW and 91% like JWFK.

In the end it falls right in line with TLW I feel.

Yeah, exactly.
No way the same level of backlash as for JP3. Just like every JP sequel except for JP3, some love them, some hate them.

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PostSubject: Re: Analyzing the why behind the backlash of Fallen Kingdom and how valid it is   Wed Jul 04, 2018 4:54 pm

This is an interesting out look that says some good and some bad things without being a review.


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PostSubject: Re: Analyzing the why behind the backlash of Fallen Kingdom and how valid it is   Wed Jul 04, 2018 5:02 pm

^Damn, that's probably the best analysis of the movie I have seen recently Very Happy It perfectly balances out the good and bad points, and explains where the movie succeeds and where it fails in a reasonable and a well constructed manner. We need more movie outlooks like this imo Very Happy
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PostSubject: Re: Analyzing the why behind the backlash of Fallen Kingdom and how valid it is   Thu Jul 05, 2018 11:18 am

@owenpratt wrote:
@Spiegel wrote:
con·fir·ma·tion bi·as
noun
the tendency to interpret new evidence as confirmation of one's existing beliefs or theories.

This applies to both sides of the argument here. The only real consensus we have are:

Our Polls
Rating Scores

Numbers dont lie. Thus JWFK rates above JP3 and barely below TLW. On IMDB JWFK is like 0.1 better but on rotten tomatoes and metacritic it's only 51% on both while TLW is 53% and 59% respectively
According to Google users voting 88% like TLW and 91% like JWFK.

In the end it falls right in line with TLW I feel.

Yeah, exactly.
No way the same level of backlash as for JP3. Just like every JP sequel except for JP3, some love them, some hate them.

It is kinda hard to compare the backlash actually because at the time of JP3 there was no social media. But I clearly remember long threads on message boards and fans being mad. However with JWFK I am looking at the comments sections on many many YouTube videos since the selease of JWFK and there is a lot more negative comments than positive ones. Im not sure if it is 50 50 love or hate.

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PostSubject: Re: Analyzing the why behind the backlash of Fallen Kingdom and how valid it is   Thu Jul 05, 2018 5:06 pm

#TRexSpinorematch wrote:

However with JWFK I am looking at the comments sections on many many YouTube videos since the selease of JWFK and there is a lot more negative comments than positive ones.

It's the YouTube comments section. They are always mostly negative so that's no surprise.

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PostSubject: Re: Analyzing the why behind the backlash of Fallen Kingdom and how valid it is   Thu Jul 05, 2018 5:08 pm

@Dr. Wu wrote:
YouTube comments are always mostly negative though.

Especially with movies and video games.
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PostSubject: Re: Analyzing the why behind the backlash of Fallen Kingdom and how valid it is   Thu Jul 05, 2018 7:11 pm

But on Youtube videos about the original Jurassic Park the comments section is always nothing but positive...
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PostSubject: Re: Analyzing the why behind the backlash of Fallen Kingdom and how valid it is   Fri Jul 06, 2018 12:37 am

#TRexSpinorematch wrote:
But on Youtube videos about the original Jurassic Park the comments section is always nothing but positive...

JP is an all time classic though. Generally, my experience is that if the general consensus on a film is anything less than amazing, it tends to get murdered on Youtube comments sections. Films like Iron Man 2, Thor: The Dark World and JW all come to mind.

Don't get me wrong, there are obvious exceptions, TLW probably being the most notable within our community, but Youtube comments sections tend to be pretty septic when it comes to most forms of contemporary art.

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PostSubject: Re: Analyzing the why behind the backlash of Fallen Kingdom and how valid it is   Sat Jul 07, 2018 7:31 pm

It's just frustrating to see people saying that the franchise is now at the same level as Transformers, Fast and Furious and Pirates Of The Caribbean.

I don't think the movie deserves all this backlash, it has incredible set pieces, flawless direction and cinematography and some really good topics in the script. Sure some of the dialogues aren't good and the movie has some silly moments but MCU movies also have this flaws and nobody seems to care at all. It isn't a perfect movie by any means but it's better than a lot of the other blockbusters that receives nothing but praise.

Hopefully JW3 will be one hell of a movie, we need less negativity towards the franchise if we want this new trilogy to be respected. Colin needs to step up his writing skills but people also need to be less hypocrites when it comes to judging movies. I feel like we're facing a terrible timing where every big blockbuster that isn't a super hero movie or a star wars one receives tons of hate in social media, it also doesn't help that a lot of people seems to hate Trevorrow after Book Of Henry + him being fired of directing EP IX.

I'm not against constructive criticism and fans doing that just shows how much they love the franchise and wants to see the next movie doing well but that isn't what's happening with FK outside of the Jurassic fandom and that's just sad.
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PostSubject: Re: Analyzing the why behind the backlash of Fallen Kingdom and how valid it is   Sat Jul 07, 2018 10:05 pm

Actually Trevorrow is one of the most popular people with the Star Wars fandom right now.

A big reason why The Last Jedi was hated was because Kathleen Kennedy and Rian Johnson wanted to make Luke Skywalker (the former iconic hero) a coward that dies and Trevorrow was against that. He told them he needed Luke alive for a big role in Episode 9 and was fired for it. Mark Hamill also said he was "on the same page" with Colin Trevorrow.

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PostSubject: Re: Analyzing the why behind the backlash of Fallen Kingdom and how valid it is   Fri Jul 13, 2018 5:33 am

@Mr. Robustus wrote:
To be fair, the "dinosaurs as weapons" subplot is Spielberg's fault, not Trevorrow's. Spielberg for some reason loves the idea and keeps pushing the writers to include that in some way in these new movies. Trevorrow has admitted in an interview he agrees that the idea of weaponized dinosaurs is kind of silly and unrealistic, but he has to include it anyway, because it's Steven Spielberg.

You might recall that a lot of the ideas/scripts for the fourth movie (back when it was stuck in development hell) included weaponized dinosaurs in some capacity, waaay before Trevorrow got involved with the franchise. Spielberg always thought that having dinosaurs in wars would be the next logical step for the franchise.
Thank God someone else has noticed this. I've been really frustrated with Trevorrow being blamed for this, when so much of what's wrong with the current JW films is just an extension of the same bad concepts we saw in the early scripts ten years ago. I credit Trevorrow a lot with making the best of some very difficult concepts. I think a lot of directors would have played Owen and Blue exactly the way our antagonists (like Hoskins and Mills) see them and appreciate that he brought that relationship as down to earth as the concept could be taken.

I'm not crazy about how the dinosaurs as weapons plotline has been used, but I think it has/had potential, but my approach would've been wildly different. It's possible the next film may carry it, but I would have probably focused on a subtler, financial-based approach, sort of like what JW was implying via Hoskins for much of it, and less Wu intentionally tailoring experiments for military purposes and potential buyers.
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