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 "I rode a motorcycle through the jungle with raptors"

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Amadieus
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PostSubject: Re: "I rode a motorcycle through the jungle with raptors"   Fri Jun 29, 2018 3:01 pm

While I do like human villians, I really hope that in JW3 we see some feral raptors again and a T-rex that is to be feared. I am not against Blue, but to have her in JWFK to be the sole raptor and a tame one as well, should not re-occur in JW3.

The line of Owen itself stood out a little bit. Like someone else mentioned: wow Owen you really are some hot shot. But I did like the conversation in general with Franklin.
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PostSubject: Re: "I rode a motorcycle through the jungle with raptors"   Fri Jun 29, 2018 3:22 pm

Franklin's reply was actually funny, but Owen's bragging was just stupid and referencing JW too much, I didn't like it at all, just like I don't like Owen's attitude in general. But what to do? They've decided to put him front and center for the whole trilogy. So the best I can do is hope that in JW3 they put emphasis back on the dinosaurs, and hopefully that will include feral velociraptors.
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PostSubject: Re: "I rode a motorcycle through the jungle with raptors"   Fri Jun 29, 2018 3:26 pm

Let's be honest. if you were Owen, you'd be bragging too.

I disagree that the raptors are portrayed as domesticated. We still got some amazing raptor kill sequences in this movie that prove the raptors are still deadly animals.
If JW and FK hadn't taken them in this new direction, would we still find them interesting?

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PostSubject: Re: "I rode a motorcycle through the jungle with raptors"   Fri Jun 29, 2018 3:29 pm

@TheRexMan22 wrote:
If JW and FK hadn't taken them in this new direction, would we still find them interesting?

I don't know, depends how they're done. By JP3 I was getting kind of fed up with them, but every time I watch the original movie or TLW again I feel the excitement every time they're on screen. I'm going to copy and paste something I wrote in the thread "Dino of the day: Velociraptor", since it applies here as well:

I have to be totally honest, and this is probably going to offend a lot of people, but one thing I really hate (and probably the only thing I actually hate) about these new movies is how they took the scariest and coolest dinosaur in the franchise and turned it into a pet/hero. I honestly can't stand it, and it bothers me every time I watch Jurassic World and Fallen Kingdom. I thought it was bad when the raptors at the end of JP3 left the humans alone as a thank you. I never imagined I'd one day see them as a pet in JP movie. It really ruins the movies for me, this whole "Blue, this one's for you, girl" crap. These are the creatures I was terrified of as a kid and at the same time loved for how ruthless and dangerous to humans they were. When we went from them opening doors to "raptors are the smartest thing in the universe" it was the beginning of the end for them as a true menace. Really hoping that JW3 will focus less not only on hybrids but on pet raptors.
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PostSubject: Re: "I rode a motorcycle through the jungle with raptors"   Fri Jun 29, 2018 3:41 pm

If you think about it... what else COULD they have done with the raptors?
Weaponizing/training them seems like the only way to go from here.
And like I said in the Dino Of The Day thread, the fact that these animals are shown to have empathy makes it all the more disturbing when they turn on you, because they're fully aware of their actions.

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PostSubject: Re: "I rode a motorcycle through the jungle with raptors"   Fri Jun 29, 2018 4:27 pm

@Dilophosaurus wrote:
@Spinosaur4.4 wrote:
@Dilophosaurus wrote:
Lol. Blue is like the T-800 to the Indoraptor's T-1000.

On topic: I liked the line and am actually quite enjoying the "face turn" of the raptors. Owen is the only person that can control Blue (and even then, not fully), and we still got several nice raptor kills in JW and FK (Blue taking out those two lab technicians was glorious).

Also it's actually not unrealistic for a man to form a bond with a raptor, because humans have formed bonds with big predators in real life like lions, crocodiles and bears.

Plus we already had three movies of wild raptors.

I would love to see Owen train chimpanzees. He would get his face destroyed when they reached teenage ages. Would be glorious. Cool

There's a very far line btw WILD animals and domestic animals.  We shouldn't forget that. Blue's not domestic to be Owen's pet.


Crocodiles, lions, chimps, dolphins, whales and bears aren't domestic pets either, yet there are cases where each one (and many other dangerous animals) has had a close bond with a human similar to Owen's bond with Blue.

I'm not saying it's impossible. I'm saying that animal behaviour is a lot MORE complex than what the movies play out with Owen and Blue. The way they make their relationship seems forced AND makes Blue seem like a domestic animal, something she isn't.

And let's not forget she's an animal of a species that didn't live with humans or any big mammal to interact with, so...



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PostSubject: Re: "I rode a motorcycle through the jungle with raptors"   Fri Jun 29, 2018 4:29 pm

@TheRexMan22 wrote:
Let's be honest. if you were Owen, you'd be bragging too.


Unless I was a badass scientist who made something important for my field, no, I wouldn't be bragging. Razz

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PostSubject: Re: "I rode a motorcycle through the jungle with raptors"   Fri Jun 29, 2018 6:06 pm

@TheRexMan22 wrote:
If you think about it... what else COULD they have done with the raptors?
Weaponizing/training them seems like the only way to go from here.
And like I said in the Dino Of The Day thread, the fact that these animals are shown to have empathy makes it all the more disturbing when they turn on you, because they're fully aware of their actions.

But we can easily have both. Blue comes from a special breed of raptors that are more open towards humans. Why not have feral raptors in JW3 that act like the raptors from JP and TLW and Blue. Maybe have a fight scene similar to the raptor fight in TLW. Blue versus some wild raptors.
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PostSubject: Re: "I rode a motorcycle through the jungle with raptors"   Fri Jun 29, 2018 6:44 pm

Yeah, then we can root for the goodguy raptor to win instead of the meanies who were never domesticated.
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PostSubject: Re: "I rode a motorcycle through the jungle with raptors"   Fri Jun 29, 2018 7:58 pm

I wish that line was a person, so I could punch it in the face.

I really dislike Owen, both as a character and as a protagonist. But what I hate more than that is how the scriptwriters feel obligated to constantly remind the audience how much of a "badass" he is through dialogue. Jesus, Jurassic World, show, don't tell.

About tamed Raptors: I didn't mind it much in the first JW, but I think it has overstated its welcome. Most of Blue's scenes in the third act of FK felt like a retread of scenes from the first Jurassic World. Even her farewell with Owen was IDENTICAL to the one in the end of Jurassic World. Are they gonna do that again in the end of the third movie?

They really should've killed off Blue at the end of Fallen Kingdom, and either have a new pack of Raptors in the next movie, or just ditch raptors altogether and focus on other small/medium carnivores (which is what I would've done. I'm kind of sick of the obligatory Velociraptor at this point).

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PostSubject: Re: "I rode a motorcycle through the jungle with raptors"   Fri Jun 29, 2018 8:02 pm

@Mr. Robustus wrote:
I wish that line was a person, so I could punch it in the face.

I really dislike Owen, both as a character and as a protagonist. But what I hate more than that is how the scriptwriters feel obligated to constantly remind the audience how much of a "badass" he is through dialogue. Jesus, Jurassic World, show, don't tell.

About tamed Raptors: I didn't mind it much in the first JW, but I think it has overstated its welcome. Most of Blue's scenes in the third act of FK felt like a retread of scenes from the first Jurassic World. Even her farewell with Owen was IDENTICAL to the one in the end of Jurassic World. Are they gonna do that again in the end of the third movie?

They really should've killed off Blue at the end of Fallen Kingdom, and either have a new pack of Raptors in the next movie, or just ditch raptors altogether and focus on other small/medium carnivores (which is what I would've done. I'm kind of sick of the obligatory Velociraptor at this point).

THIS.

I love you already. Razz

I think I would have made a whole new pack of feral raptors for JW3.

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PostSubject: Re: "I rode a motorcycle through the jungle with raptors"   Sat Jun 30, 2018 5:31 am

@Mr. Robustus wrote:
I wish that line was a person, so I could punch it in the face.

I really dislike Owen, both as a character and as a protagonist. But what I hate more than that is how the scriptwriters feel obligated to constantly remind the audience how much of a "badass" he is through dialogue. Jesus, Jurassic World, show, don't tell.

About tamed Raptors: I didn't mind it much in the first JW, but I think it has overstated its welcome. Most of Blue's scenes in the third act of FK felt like a retread of scenes from the first Jurassic World. Even her farewell with Owen was IDENTICAL to the one in the end of Jurassic World. Are they gonna do that again in the end of the third movie?

They really should've killed off Blue at the end of Fallen Kingdom, and either have a new pack of Raptors in the next movie, or just ditch raptors altogether and focus on other small/medium carnivores (which is what I would've done. I'm kind of sick of the obligatory Velociraptor at this point).

Haha, awesome post. I agree with everything, and especially the last thing you said about the obligatory velociraptors. Can't we move on? There are so many other cool dinosaurs. When Crichton and Spielberg chose them, I don't think they were thinking that they would be the main focus of an entire franchise. It becomes tedious at some point (and that point has long arrived).
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PostSubject: Re: "I rode a motorcycle through the jungle with raptors"   Sat Jun 30, 2018 12:57 pm

I laughed more at Franklin's follow-up line. "We're not compatible."

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PostSubject: Re: "I rode a motorcycle through the jungle with raptors"   Sat Jun 30, 2018 12:59 pm

@Levine wrote:
I laughed more at Franklin's follow-up line. "We're not compatible."

Yeah, me too. At first Owen's line disgusted me, then Franklin's reply made me laugh. And somehow Owen is supposed to be the hero.
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PostSubject: Re: "I rode a motorcycle through the jungle with raptors"   Sat Jun 30, 2018 10:11 pm

eh did this really deserve an entire thread? been seeing a lot of random threads like this that should be compiled into one, like a "things I don't like about the film" type of thread. As for the line itself, I don't really see a problem with it and let's be honest riding through the jungle with raptors is something I would brag about.
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PostSubject: Re: "I rode a motorcycle through the jungle with raptors"   Sun Jul 01, 2018 4:37 am

It was clearly a comedic line in order to make a funny interaction between Owen and Franklin. "I was disgusted", "He's full of himself", damn, you guys should just relax a bit before going to the movies ahah

And you guys say you wouldn't be bragging for being able to ride a motorcycle through the jungle with a pack of raptors, while as soon as you get a new Jurassic toy you share it to Twitter, Instagram and the world to get likes, RTs, etc Laughing (I do that too. Imagine if I managed to ride a motorcycle through the jungle with raptors

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PostSubject: Re: "I rode a motorcycle through the jungle with raptors"   Sun Jul 01, 2018 11:43 am

@Spinosaur4.4 wrote:
THIS.

I love you already. Razz

I think I would have made a whole new pack of feral raptors for JW3.

@Lost wrote:
Haha, awesome post. I agree with everything, and especially the last thing you said about the obligatory velociraptors. Can't we move on? There are so many other cool dinosaurs. When Crichton and Spielberg chose them, I don't think they were thinking that they would be the main focus of an entire franchise. It becomes tedious at some point (and that point has long arrived).

Thank you, thank you. Embarassed

Even back in the second movie, the Velociraptors already felt kind of tacked on. In the first Jurassic Park, they were like super villains whose role was carefully built up throughout the entire movie, from the very first scene. In TLW, they are mentioned once by Ludlow and Burke as a possible problem, then they appear to wipe the remaining mercenaries and as a random final obstacle between the main characters and the rescue helicopter. Just think how much room we could have for scenes with Carnotaurus, Allosaurus, Ceratosaurus, Dilophosaurus or Compsognathus if the filmmakers just for once ditched the obligatory Velociraptor scenes.

@owenpratt wrote:
It was clearly a comedic line in order to make a funny interaction between Owen and Franklin. "I was disgusted", "He's full of himself", damn, you guys should just relax a bit before going to the movies ahah

Again, that line represents a recurring problem that both of these Jurassic World movies have, that the third is probably gonna have: Trevorrow and Connolly for some reason think their own caricatural character is awesome, and they want the audience to know that the other characters agree.

"Your boyfriend is a badass!" - Zach

"No, no! Him! Definitely him!" - Zach and Gray, being deeply impressed after watching Owen *gasp* drive a jeep in reverse.

"Awesome!" - Hoskins

"Yeah!" - Raptor pen worker, looking up to Owen like he's seeing the face of God for the first time.

"OW!" - Zach and Gray, reacting to Owen punching a middle-aged fat guy they have no idea who it is.

"... We're not compatible." - Franklin, after realizing he's stuck flying for next few hours with an absolute badass.

"Yeah, square jaw, good bone structure, tall, muscles. I don’t date men, but if I did, it would be you." - Zia, in that terrible, terrible line of dialogue that was thankfully cut. (does that mean she only dates 6 ft tall muscular women with square jaws? and that she's disgusted by women with osteoporosis?)

"Gee, that Crisp Rat action hero kid sure is swell! He gets things done!" - Grant or Sattler, in inevitable Jurassic World 3 dialogue, after seeing Owen being an absolute boss at something. Like tying his shoes. Or building a shack with no tools other than a hammer. Or surviving unemployed for an indefinite amount of time after Jurassic World is closed.

Remember that awesome scene in Jurassic Park, where Grant stared down a seven-plus ton T. rex with only a flare and his paleontological knowledge, and the movie cut to Malcolm inside the tour car, saying "Oh, golly! That Dr. Grant guy sure is something!"? That was always my favorite part.

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PostSubject: Re: "I rode a motorcycle through the jungle with raptors"   Sun Jul 01, 2018 12:36 pm

@Mr. Robustus wrote:
In the first Jurassic Park, they were like super villains whose role was carefully built up throughout the entire movie, from the very first scene.

This. A hundred times this. This is what these new filmmakers need to understand, the build-up was a huge part of what made the velociraptors so scary in this movie, it was such a pay-off when we finally got to see them in action. Not to mention that they were something new and terrifying, something never seen on screen before. By JP3 they had become a commodity and thus a bit more tedious. That's a shame, because all you have to do is watch the first movie again to see how how scary they were back then, thanks to the build-up. We need something similar with a new species, there's more than enough to choose from. I really don't understand why they've not done that, and just keep giving us the velociraptor over and over and over and over. And now as heroes? I mean come on!
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PostSubject: Re: "I rode a motorcycle through the jungle with raptors"   Sun Jul 01, 2018 2:37 pm

It's not the line as much as the plot piece in general. JW's attempt to humanize the raptors.

In Crichton's original novel and Spielberg's JP, they were mysterious, vicious predators from eons ago. Almost like alien invaders from another world. They answered to no man, but their own 65 million year old instinct.

Owen really has no reason to be that arrogant but for plot armour. If Owen's interactions with raptors were at all realistic, he would've been attacked, mauled or bitten at least once given how much time he spent around them.
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PostSubject: Re: "I rode a motorcycle through the jungle with raptors"   Sun Jul 01, 2018 2:38 pm

@Baryonyx wrote:
It's not the line as much as the plot piece in general. JW's attempt to humanize the raptors.

In Crichton's original novel and Spielberg's JP, they were mysterious, vicious predators from eons ago. Almost like alien invaders from another world. They answered to no man, but their own 65 million year old instinct.

Owen really has no reason to be that arrogant but for plot armour. If Owen's interactions with raptors were at all realistic, he would've been attacked, mauled or bitten at least once given how much time he spent around them.

Good post, I agree completely.
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PostSubject: Re: "I rode a motorcycle through the jungle with raptors"   Sun Jul 01, 2018 2:51 pm

Honestly during the flashback video they showed us, the difference between baby Delta and baby Blue's reaction to Owen was staggering. Like night and day.

Also the scene at the end where Blue once again seems to ask Owen what to do, that spoke to me a bit about where Blue is in regards to Owen.

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PostSubject: Re: "I rode a motorcycle through the jungle with raptors"   Sun Jul 01, 2018 11:48 pm

@Mr. Robustus wrote:
@Spinosaur4.4 wrote:
THIS.

I love you already. Razz

I think I would have made a whole new pack of feral raptors for JW3.

@Lost wrote:
Haha, awesome post. I agree with everything, and especially the last thing you said about the obligatory velociraptors. Can't we move on? There are so many other cool dinosaurs. When Crichton and Spielberg chose them, I don't think they were thinking that they would be the main focus of an entire franchise. It becomes tedious at some point (and that point has long arrived).

Thank you, thank you. Embarassed

Even back in the second movie, the Velociraptors already felt kind of tacked on. In the first Jurassic Park, they were like super villains whose role was carefully built up throughout the entire movie, from the very first scene. In TLW, they are mentioned once by Ludlow and Burke as a possible problem, then they appear to wipe the remaining mercenaries and as a random final obstacle between the main characters and the rescue helicopter. Just think how much room we could have for scenes with Carnotaurus, Allosaurus, Ceratosaurus, Dilophosaurus or Compsognathus if the filmmakers just for once ditched the obligatory Velociraptor scenes.

@owenpratt wrote:
It was clearly a comedic line in order to make a funny interaction between Owen and Franklin. "I was disgusted", "He's full of himself", damn, you guys should just relax a bit before going to the movies ahah

Again, that line represents a recurring problem that both of these Jurassic World movies have, that the third is probably gonna have: Trevorrow and Connolly for some reason think their own caricatural character is awesome, and they want the audience to know that the other characters agree.

"Your boyfriend is a badass!" - Zach

"No, no! Him! Definitely him!" - Zach and Gray, being deeply impressed after watching Owen *gasp* drive a jeep in reverse.

"Awesome!" - Hoskins

"Yeah!" - Raptor pen worker, looking up to Owen like he's seeing the face of God for the first time.

"OW!" - Zach and Gray, reacting to Owen punching a middle-aged fat guy they have no idea who it is.

"... We're not compatible." - Franklin, after realizing he's stuck flying for next few hours with an absolute badass.

"Yeah, square jaw, good bone structure, tall, muscles. I don’t date men, but if I did, it would be you." - Zia, in that terrible, terrible line of dialogue that was thankfully cut. (does that mean she only dates 6 ft tall muscular women with square jaws? and that she's disgusted by women with osteoporosis?)

"Gee, that Crisp Rat action hero kid sure is swell! He gets things done!" - Grant or Sattler, in inevitable Jurassic World 3 dialogue, after seeing Owen being an absolute boss at something. Like tying his shoes. Or building a shack with no tools other than a hammer. Or surviving unemployed for an indefinite amount of time after Jurassic World is closed.

Remember that awesome scene in Jurassic Park, where Grant stared down a seven-plus ton T. rex with only a flare and his paleontological knowledge, and the movie cut to Malcolm inside the tour car, saying "Oh, golly! That Dr. Grant guy sure is something!"? That was always my favorite part.

THIS. SO. MUCH.
Everything I wanted to say is in your post.

By the way, I agree with Baryonyx. Owen has no reason to be arrogant and cocky, and his relationship with raptors is not realistic, to be honest. Animal behaviour is waaaaay more complicated than that.

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PostSubject: Re: "I rode a motorcycle through the jungle with raptors"   Mon Jul 02, 2018 3:04 am

Science is more complicated than what the movie shows, yet I don't claim Dr Wu's researches are not realistic (in-universe) and he's arrogant ("All of this exists because of me").
There's sure much more to the relationship between Owen and Blue, but we don't get to see it unless the movie is 3-4 hours long.

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PostSubject: Re: "I rode a motorcycle through the jungle with raptors"   Mon Jul 02, 2018 3:05 am

wow, you guys really don't like Owen haha. I'm sensing more of a bias against this type of character (the macho mans man type) than the delivery and writing of the movie. Honestly to me, he's my favorite character and that's mostly due to Chris pratt's natural charisma and the idea of a raptor trainer just sounding like the coolest job ever. I feel like this movie did a way better job of making me care for blue and Owen's relationship and the only time blue felt like a domesticated was in the scenes when she was a baby. Honestly, I don't see how their relationship is harder to believe then say the idea that we could resurrect dinosaurs through cloning 65 million year old DNA Rolling Eyes
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PostSubject: Re: "I rode a motorcycle through the jungle with raptors"   Mon Jul 02, 2018 3:09 am

Yeah, I honestly like Owen as well. If I managed to have a relationship with a pack of raptors I would be proud of myself as well. Most people in this thread probably would not (suuure) lol

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Jurassic World exists to remind us how very small we are, how new. You can't put a price on that Velociraptor

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PostSubject: Re: "I rode a motorcycle through the jungle with raptors"   Mon Jul 02, 2018 3:14 am

Their relationship in this film is one of the only things critics praise.
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PostSubject: Re: "I rode a motorcycle through the jungle with raptors"   Mon Jul 02, 2018 3:55 am

Yeah lol the extreme Owen hate in this thread is kind of baffling to me.
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PostSubject: Re: "I rode a motorcycle through the jungle with raptors"   Mon Jul 02, 2018 4:07 am

@Herrerasaurus wrote:
Their relationship in this film is one of the only things critics praise.

This to me just confirms yet again that professional critics are completely worthless.
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PostSubject: Re: "I rode a motorcycle through the jungle with raptors"   Mon Jul 02, 2018 4:17 am

Not to mention, Owen is also the one who clearly points out what an asinine idea it is to train dinosaurs for warfare, so that's a plus.

And I actually really liked Owen and Blue's relationship in FK, it made for some emotional moments. It felt like a real handler/animal relationship that could actually happen (minus the things like the nod in JW Very Happy).

But I agree that it would be great to see wild, aggresive raptors again. Or better yet, a new medium sized-small carnivore: the Herrerasaurs would be nice, or even better: the Troodons (it's about time those creepy f***ers got a spotlight).
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PostSubject: Re: "I rode a motorcycle through the jungle with raptors"   Mon Jul 02, 2018 4:32 am

@Dv-218 wrote:
or even better: the Troodons (it's about time those creepy f***ers got a spotlight).

Hell yes, that would be a dream come true!
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