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 Is anybody else having second thoughts about this movie?

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PostSubject: Re: Is anybody else having second thoughts about this movie?   Sat Feb 10, 2018 7:30 pm

#TRexSpinorematch wrote:
@TyrannosaurTJ wrote:
#TRexSpinorematch wrote:
The JP movies do have a theme of humans being arrogant with nature but all of the films end up with dinosaurs chasing humans.

It is a bit of a one trick pony. But I am not saying thst in a bad way.

I think the thing CT is trying to say here is that you are grossly over-simplifying what the JP movies are specifically and taking them to base construct of more or less being monster films where the monster chases people and they run. CT was pointing out how other movies like Godfather and Star Wars could ultimately have the same thing done to in the end to them as well.

Outside, all movies can and are eventually broken down to that level in their baseness, but the problem is when the powers that be are doing that and not providing a worthwhile or compelling plot. JW, while a safe 'soft-reboot" did a good job (for me at least) of restoring a small amount of faith for the direction of the series. So I feel that FK is attempting to spice things up with a more horror/action adventure direction here now. So it's going to focus on that chase commonality, but it is going to where and how the Crichton novels were when they were published. Going back to the source material helps refine the direction things were going.

I know the original goal of the first book and movie was the message of man not being in control of nature and trying to toy with it by trying to work with dinosaurs.

However, the monster movie element is still a huge part of the series DNA. And my point is, there is only so much you can do with the theme of man trying to control dinosaurs and having it backfire. More so when you know that many fans seem to not like the idea of a Jurassic War or the idea of having ice age creatures on the series.

But then I go on facebook and find the majority of the fans seem to think the entire series is about dinosaur battles or which dino would win what... and th I dont like the fact we got a second hybrid. Shouldnt have happened. Especially if your just going to do it for third act surprise. I would've liked it better if we revealed Wu had been making his own dinosaurs/raptor pack and Blue had to pick between that pack and Owen.

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PostSubject: Re: Is anybody else having second thoughts about this movie?   Sat Feb 10, 2018 7:53 pm

The way I see it, the series can be about whatever the hell you want it to be about. The dangers of playing God. How technological advancement can backfire. The ethics of profiting from living creatures. Kickass dinosaurs. It's all relative in the end.

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PostSubject: Re: Is anybody else having second thoughts about this movie?   Sat Feb 10, 2018 9:34 pm

@Tyrant Lizard wrote:
@Rhedosaurus wrote:
People are far more knowledgeable about movies and their productions then they were 20-25 years ago and the internet has grown into a monster at this point.

If these people think this film is going to be remake of TLW, then I wouldn't be giving the general audience as much credit as you are.

And again, we have no idea what the context is behind the opening scene is. If something happened the helicopter transporting Wu's research, then all of the sudden the scene makes a lot more sense.

To be fair, considering how even many fans think JW was a semi-remake of JP, and how even people who like JW (myself included) think that it should have been better then what it was, I don't think that you can necessarily blame them too much.

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PostSubject: Re: Is anybody else having second thoughts about this movie?   Sat Feb 10, 2018 10:21 pm

I'm going to retort with one of my favorite minor details in the first novel. After the T. rex attack, Grant and the kids use a root growing out of a crack in the concrete moat of the T. rex paddock.to climb out of the moat. Most people would overlook such a small detail, but it's actually very important.

See, it shows that the park, even before Nedry sabotaged it, had cracks in what should be a very impermeable structure. This small detail is a huge metaphor for the park. Before the park is open, before we learn that the dinosaurs are breeding and even getting off the island, we learn that the park is crumbling under the weight of its own hubris. That man's temporary landmarks will always be crushed by the forces of nature. The the dinosaurs in JP are only metaphorical, and could have been replaced by any product of science and engineering with the message being the same. To reduce that message to "The movies are about dinosaurs chasing people" is to reduce genius metaphorical writing to generic monster mash schlock.

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PostSubject: Re: Is anybody else having second thoughts about this movie?   Sun Feb 11, 2018 5:11 am

I never said the movies were only about dinosaurs chasing people and nothing else.

What I was trying to say is that is where the movies always end up and that's why fans should not expect something way out of the ordinary in JWFK. That was my point.

Wich is true, the movies always end up with dinosaurs chasing people. But I was never trying to say that they are all about mindless action and little else. Nor was I trying to diminish the message that they have.
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PostSubject: Re: Is anybody else having second thoughts about this movie?   Sun Feb 11, 2018 8:55 pm

Wait, where did this claim that Bayona had next to no influence on the film come from? If you've seen his past films i.e. The Impossible, The Orphanage and A Monster Calls, you'll know that just from looking at the trailer that his style and visual influence is all over it.

Regarding the plot holes, you can't really call them plot holes since we don't have any context yet. The new film could involve different aspects of the plot that explain away these potential issues.
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PostSubject: Re: Is anybody else having second thoughts about this movie?   Sun Feb 11, 2018 8:59 pm

#TRexSpinorematch wrote:
The JP movies do have a theme of humans being arrogant with nature but all of the films end up with dinosaurs chasing humans.

It is a bit of a one trick pony. But I am not saying thst in a bad way.

You could say:

All superhero movies are Hero vs villain fights
All Alien movies are Xenomorphs eating people
All Star Wars Movies are just space battles
All Godzilla movies are Godzilla destroying cities
All Mission Impossible movies are actually Mission Possible movies
All James Bond movies are James Bond saving the day

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PostSubject: Re: Is anybody else having second thoughts about this movie?   Sun Feb 11, 2018 9:02 pm

@Rhedosaurus wrote:
There is also another reason why I'm having second thoughts about this movie. I just don't think that it's not the movie we need at this moment. There are just so many possibilities that this franchise could have taken.

1. Biosyn or some other company making dinosaurs in secret labs located in the jungles of Africa, South America, and parts of Asia (Papua New Guinea) where dinosaurs have been sighted and reported. Mokele-Mbembe being the most famous of these cryptosaurs.

2. A movie that takes place between JP3 and JW to connect the two trilogies better.

3. A movie that takes place on one of the other islands with new dinosaurs we haven't seen: Pentaceratops, a feathered Anzu population, an Archaeopterx population, Pectinodon which used to be known as Troodon (Troodon isn't considered a valid species anymore, but Pectinodon was reinstated in 2013. So according to the rules of science, all Troodon fossils found in the same fossil formations as T. rex, Triceratops, Edmontosaurus, and other Late Cretaceous dinosaurs now belong to Pectinodon.), Deinocheirus, Appalachiosaurus, and so much more.


As a side note: In fairness, I can also make this argument for JP3 as well. Since that movie was made for the sake of a trilogy with no real soul in it.


Yet, here we are getting a movie that many people, even the GA, are going to consider a semi-remake of The Lost World. Some of us have seen this movie get referred to as 'Jurassic World: The Lost Park' and at this point, it's hard for me to blame those people. People are far more knowledgeable about movies and their productions then they were 20-25 years ago and the internet has grown into a monster at this point. Throw in just how dumb the beginning of this movie will be, and I don't think that the GA can be counted on as much like they were for the first JW movie.

Remember, there needs to be a bridge of sorts in order to expand the storyline to different unexplored territory. We can't just randomly get from point a to c, we need to go through b first. FK is the bridge film. Jurassic World 3 will be the new territory.
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PostSubject: Re: Is anybody else having second thoughts about this movie?   Sun Feb 11, 2018 9:04 pm

#TRexSpinorematch wrote:
@TyrannosaurTJ wrote:
#TRexSpinorematch wrote:
The JP movies do have a theme of humans being arrogant with nature but all of the films end up with dinosaurs chasing humans.

It is a bit of a one trick pony. But I am not saying thst in a bad way.

I think the thing CT is trying to say here is that you are grossly over-simplifying what the JP movies are specifically and taking them to base construct of more or less being monster films where the monster chases people and they run. CT was pointing out how other movies like Godfather and Star Wars could ultimately have the same thing done to in the end to them as well.

Outside, all movies can and are eventually broken down to that level in their baseness, but the problem is when the powers that be are doing that and not providing a worthwhile or compelling plot. JW, while a safe 'soft-reboot" did a good job (for me at least) of restoring a small amount of faith for the direction of the series. So I feel that FK is attempting to spice things up with a more horror/action adventure direction here now. So it's going to focus on that chase commonality, but it is going to where and how the Crichton novels were when they were published. Going back to the source material helps refine the direction things were going.

I know the original goal of the first book and movie was the message of man not being in control of nature and trying to toy with it by trying to work with dinosaurs.

However, the monster movie element is still a huge part of the series DNA. And my point is, there is only so much you can do with the theme of man trying to control dinosaurs and having it backfire. More so when you know that many fans seem to not like the idea of a Jurassic War or the idea of having ice age creatures on the series.

This movie is less about man controlling nature (it's still present of course) and more about man's responsibility for its creations.
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PostSubject: Re: Is anybody else having second thoughts about this movie?   Mon Feb 12, 2018 2:26 am

Again, I wasn't trying to simplify the movies as run from dinosaurs movies and only that.

Of course they have other elements to them, what I was only pointing out is that the way the Jurassic movie formula has been done, is to set up the theme of man trying to "control" nature only to later show nature having them in trouble through dinosaurs attacking them.

My point is that there is only so much you can do with dinosaurs attacking humans without changing the series way too much.

But that is in no way implying that the series has always been a shallow movie about running away from a dinosaur and nothing else.

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PostSubject: Re: Is anybody else having second thoughts about this movie?   Mon Feb 12, 2018 8:43 pm

@Six-Foot Turkey wrote:
#TRexSpinorematch wrote:
@TyrannosaurTJ wrote:
#TRexSpinorematch wrote:
The JP movies do have a theme of humans being arrogant with nature but all of the films end up with dinosaurs chasing humans.

It is a bit of a one trick pony. But I am not saying thst in a bad way.

I think the thing CT is trying to say here is that you are grossly over-simplifying what the JP movies are specifically and taking them to base construct of more or less being monster films where the monster chases people and they run. CT was pointing out how other movies like Godfather and Star Wars could ultimately have the same thing done to in the end to them as well.

Outside, all movies can and are eventually broken down to that level in their baseness, but the problem is when the powers that be are doing that and not providing a worthwhile or compelling plot. JW, while a safe 'soft-reboot" did a good job (for me at least) of restoring a small amount of faith for the direction of the series. So I feel that FK is attempting to spice things up with a more horror/action adventure direction here now. So it's going to focus on that chase commonality, but it is going to where and how the Crichton novels were when they were published. Going back to the source material helps refine the direction things were going.

I know the original goal of the first book and movie was the message of man not being in control of nature and trying to toy with it by trying to work with dinosaurs.

However, the monster movie element is still a huge part of the series DNA. And my point is, there is only so much you can do with the theme of man trying to control dinosaurs and having it backfire. More so when you know that many fans seem to not like the idea of a Jurassic War or the idea of having ice age creatures on the series.

This movie is less about man controlling nature (it's still present of course) and more about man's responsibility for its creations.
this and along with everything else you said is how I feel. My hype isn't super high but I'm cautiously optimistic.
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PostSubject: Re: Is anybody else having second thoughts about this movie?   Tue Feb 13, 2018 12:26 pm

@Six-Foot Turkey wrote:
Wait, where did this claim that Bayona had next to no influence on the film come from? If you've seen his past films i.e. The Impossible, The Orphanage and A Monster Calls, you'll know that just from looking at the trailer that his style and visual influence is all over it.

Regarding the plot holes, you can't really call them plot holes since we don't have any context yet. The new film could involve different aspects of the plot that explain away these potential issues.

Sobek said it on one of his leaks.

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PostSubject: Re: Is anybody else having second thoughts about this movie?   Tue Feb 13, 2018 12:40 pm

@Rhedosaurus wrote:
@Six-Foot Turkey wrote:
Wait, where did this claim that Bayona had next to no influence on the film come from? If you've seen his past films i.e. The Impossible, The Orphanage and A Monster Calls, you'll know that just from looking at the trailer that his style and visual influence is all over it.

Regarding the plot holes, you can't really call them plot holes since we don't have any context yet. The new film could involve different aspects of the plot that explain away these potential issues.

Sobek said it on one of his leaks.

Where can i find them?
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PostSubject: Re: Is anybody else having second thoughts about this movie?   Tue Feb 13, 2018 4:36 pm

@Rhedosaurus wrote:
@Six-Foot Turkey wrote:
Wait, where did this claim that Bayona had next to no influence on the film come from? If you've seen his past films i.e. The Impossible, The Orphanage and A Monster Calls, you'll know that just from looking at the trailer that his style and visual influence is all over it.

Regarding the plot holes, you can't really call them plot holes since we don't have any context yet. The new film could involve different aspects of the plot that explain away these potential issues.

Sobek said it on one of his leaks.

He didn't say Bayona had no influence, he just said he didn't have as much as some fans thought he would & who is to say this Sobek is a reliable source anyway? Bayona's touch is still going to be sprinkled all over FK.
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PostSubject: Re: Is anybody else having second thoughts about this movie?   Tue Feb 13, 2018 6:15 pm

@Six-Foot Turkey wrote:
@Rhedosaurus wrote:
@Six-Foot Turkey wrote:
Wait, where did this claim that Bayona had next to no influence on the film come from? If you've seen his past films i.e. The Impossible, The Orphanage and A Monster Calls, you'll know that just from looking at the trailer that his style and visual influence is all over it.

Regarding the plot holes, you can't really call them plot holes since we don't have any context yet. The new film could involve different aspects of the plot that explain away these potential issues.

Sobek said it on one of his leaks.

Where can i find them?

He said that Bayona had limited influence here.

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PostSubject: Re: Is anybody else having second thoughts about this movie?   Tue Feb 13, 2018 6:19 pm

@Rhedosaurus wrote:
@Six-Foot Turkey wrote:
@Rhedosaurus wrote:
@Six-Foot Turkey wrote:
Wait, where did this claim that Bayona had next to no influence on the film come from? If you've seen his past films i.e. The Impossible, The Orphanage and A Monster Calls, you'll know that just from looking at the trailer that his style and visual influence is all over it.

Regarding the plot holes, you can't really call them plot holes since we don't have any context yet. The new film could involve different aspects of the plot that explain away these potential issues.

Sobek said it on one of his leaks.

Where can i find them?

He said that Bayona had limited influence here.

eh. The Colin wanting bombastic bit sounds like a bash on Colin rather than something that would be true. I don't believe it. Colin has said many times that the script was made with Bayona in mind. Bayona will have known how bombastic the film was going to be when reading the script before signing on.
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PostSubject: Re: Is anybody else having second thoughts about this movie?   Tue Apr 17, 2018 3:03 pm

I had second thoughts on this movie right after the first trailer and the second trailer didn't make me feel better. I don't think the 3rd trailer will sway me either. It did work for me to go into JW with low expactations, I could enjoy that movie this way. So I won't change my strategy.
JW had some unexpected redeeming points, but I can't see that with JW:FK at the moment. There is so much stuff that makes me furious, but FK is not the first movie to raise these points to me. The dinosaurs in the new franchise just don't feel like animals anymore and that was one of the strong points in the franchise to me. This trend started in JP/// to some extant to be fair, but I doesn't make it any better for me. I don't like the explosions and silly action, I get transformers vibes from this movie. I might be to harsh, but so far I'm disappointed.

I'll use this opportunity to say hi to all who might still know me, I had to quit this forum because it devolved into Dinosaur x vs Indominus threads and I couldn't read that stuff anymore. I'm back for good I hope, so hi.
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PostSubject: Re: Is anybody else having second thoughts about this movie?   Tue Apr 17, 2018 3:53 pm

@Physalisfresser wrote:
I get transformers vibes from this movie.

I don't. I will never accept any kind of comparison between Jurassic Park/World and Transformers.

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PostSubject: Re: Is anybody else having second thoughts about this movie?   Tue Apr 17, 2018 3:59 pm

@BarrytheOnyx wrote:
@Physalisfresser wrote:
I get transformers vibes from this movie.

I don't. I will never accept any kind of comparison between Jurassic Park/World and Transformers.

It surely won't become as stupid as these movies, but the Trailers show way more explosions than I think should be in a Jurassic movie.
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PostSubject: Re: Is anybody else having second thoughts about this movie?   Tue Apr 17, 2018 4:14 pm

@BarrytheOnyx wrote:
@Physalisfresser wrote:
I get transformers vibes from this movie.

I don't. I will never accept any kind of comparison between Jurassic Park/World and Transformers.

Yeah to compare this to Transformers must mean they haven't actually seen transformers. transformers is otherworldly bad.
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PostSubject: Re: Is anybody else having second thoughts about this movie?   Tue Apr 17, 2018 4:46 pm

After seeing the teaser the other day and getting strong horror vibes...hell no. Im more than excited to see this.

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PostSubject: Re: Is anybody else having second thoughts about this movie?   Tue Apr 17, 2018 6:41 pm

Since Fallen Kingdom is starting to get me interested in volcanoes (seriously, I've been watching Pompeii like it's going out of style, and I didn't want to see it because of Kit Harington or the romance, but that awesome volcano, since the first time I saw it, I was thinking to myself: "When are the fireworks going to start?" but once they do, "Hold on to your butts!" to quote Ray Arnold from the original Jurassic Park), I'm starting to get a little excited for it, and that Mosasaur scene, OMG, though I'm a little curious as to how it got out of the lagoon, since it's in the middle of the island. Even when playing as the Mosasaur in Lego Jurassic World, I get pretty close to the bottom of the tank, and I don't see any pipes down there (unless they're hidden or have some kind of lever to open them). Very Happy

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PostSubject: Re: Is anybody else having second thoughts about this movie?   Tue Apr 17, 2018 7:26 pm

I'd just like to point out that, imho, explosions are entirely justified when your film is centered around a volcano exploding *shrugs*

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PostSubject: Re: Is anybody else having second thoughts about this movie?   Tue Apr 17, 2018 7:27 pm

@Tyrant Lizard wrote:
I'd just like to point out that, imho, explosions are entirely justified when your film is centered around a volcano exploding *shrugs*

Also, Michael Bay isn't the only director that uses explosions. Why is he the one mentioned all the time?
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PostSubject: Re: Is anybody else having second thoughts about this movie?   Wed Apr 18, 2018 4:45 am

The main reason I'm not hyped about this movie is probably because I was never fond of the hybrid idea, the Indoraptor is no plus side for me.

I don't know how to feel about the Mosasaurus, I hope it's not just out in the open now, you know a the Lost World ship situation. When they explain this I am totally ok with this scene, I''m just concerned because JW felt a bit lazily written at times.

I'll take back the Transformers thing, I think it's not what I actually wanted to say.

I don't like some Dinosaur designs in the movie, which is always a downside for a dinosaur enthusiast and no it's not because of the absence of feathers, I'm not one of those guys.

I might seem like I want to bash the movie, which is really not the case! I don't want to change anythings mind. I just want to voice my concerns. My expactation is that this movie won't have the dark and gritty feel from TLW, I hope I'm wrong about that because that would give the movie character.
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PostSubject: Re: Is anybody else having second thoughts about this movie?   Wed Apr 18, 2018 1:18 pm

@Physalisfresser wrote:
The main reason I'm not hyped about this movie is probably because I was never fond of the hybrid idea, the Indoraptor is no plus side for me.

I don't know how to feel about the Mosasaurus, I hope it's not just out in the open now, you know a the Lost World ship situation. When they explain this I am totally ok with this scene, I''m just concerned because JW felt a bit lazily written at times.

I'll take back the Transformers thing, I think it's not what I actually wanted to say.

I don't like some Dinosaur designs in the movie, which is always a downside for a dinosaur enthusiast and no it's not because of the absence of feathers, I'm not one of those guys.

I might seem like I want to bash the movie, which is really not the case! I don't want to change anythings mind. I just want to voice my concerns. My expactation is that this movie won't have the dark and gritty feel from TLW, I hope I'm wrong about that because that would give the movie character.

By comparing this movie to the Michael Bay Transformers movies, did you mean that this movie was trying to appeal to the lowest common demoninator? Because if that's what you're trying to say, then I agree with you. I like JW, but I like it more then I should. While I was willing to tolerate how dumber it was, I had higher expectations for this movie. And I also agree that this all started with JP3.

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PostSubject: Re: Is anybody else having second thoughts about this movie?   Wed Apr 18, 2018 1:28 pm

Yes, I fully agree with 2 and 3. They botter me a lot, specially 2.

But it just came to my mind that maybe
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PostSubject: Re: Is anybody else having second thoughts about this movie?   Wed Apr 18, 2018 2:32 pm

@Rhedosaurus wrote:
@Physalisfresser wrote:
The main reason I'm not hyped about this movie is probably because I was never fond of the hybrid idea, the Indoraptor is no plus side for me.

I don't know how to feel about the Mosasaurus, I hope it's not just out in the open now, you know a the Lost World ship situation. When they explain this I am totally ok with this scene, I''m just concerned because JW felt a bit lazily written at times.

I'll take back the Transformers thing, I think it's not what I actually wanted to say.

I don't like some Dinosaur designs in the movie, which is always a downside for a dinosaur enthusiast and no it's not because of the absence of feathers, I'm not one of those guys.

I might seem like I want to bash the movie, which is really not the case! I don't want to change anythings mind. I just want to voice my concerns. My expactation is that this movie won't have the dark and gritty feel from TLW, I hope I'm wrong about that because that would give the movie character.

By comparing this movie to the Michael Bay Transformers movies, did you mean that this movie was trying to appeal to the lowest common demoninator? Because if that's what you're trying to say, then I agree with you. I like JW, but I like it more then I should. While I was willing to tolerate how dumber it was, I had higher expectations for this movie. And I also agree that this all started with JP3.

Yes something similiar to what you said. The really dumbed down the Story of the movies (since JP/// to be honest). I liked the Jurassic movies because they were story driven to some aspect, but they are now pretty much dumbed down not to transformers levels of course, but they don't have a engaging story and dull characters. That's what angers me. I can live with the hybrids, although im not very fond of them. I think thy were a pretty stupid decision. I'm a little angry about how the Franchise is going, but not so much that I have to hate on it. Yeah that's basically what I wanted to say.
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PostSubject: Re: Is anybody else having second thoughts about this movie?   Fri Apr 20, 2018 5:31 am

I know they again tried the same badass hybrid formula since they think it made a lot of money in the last one (And it is clear Universal is focusing more on the general public than longtime fans) but the more trailers I see, the more I get a vibe that Fallen Kingdom is going to be very similar to Jurassic World in terms of not only being yet another sequel that centers around another more badass hybrid but also Owen seems to tell Blue to fight it at the end (Not to mention yet again ignoring The Lost World and Jurassic Park 3).

I knew it was very likely that we were going to see at least one more hybrid in this one. I just did not think it would be the main focus of the movie only to set up Blue as the hero once again.

And I am not saying the movie will be bad. It seems fun in the sense of adventure and action. Just that it will be very similar to Jurassic World in terms of plot points and scenes.

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PostSubject: Re: Is anybody else having second thoughts about this movie?   Sat Apr 21, 2018 1:10 pm

I'm personally not that excited for FK so far. It really does look like a half-assed TLW rehash coupled with a generic monster mansion story. But JW turned out to be better than I thought it looked from the marketing, so hopefully this will as well.
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